Sir, you led a forum of Northern Christian APC Leaders that opposed the Muslim-Muslim ticket of the APC which culminated into the adoption of the Presidential candidate of the PDP, Atiku Abubakar, can you tell us why you took that step?
Our journey started with the adoption of what is now popularly known in Nigeria as the same faith ticket by the APC. Before that happened, the church through CAN, had come out with a position which was later reinforced by a group of Christians from the 19 northern states and the FCT who were of the APC. Well, we held meetings upon meetings which led to a summit. At that summit, we took a crystal clear decision compelled by our vision of a united Nigeria – involving both men and women of all faiths – Christians, Muslims, even those who do not subscribe to any creed – uniting to build this country in a way that guarantees peace and prosperity; we will not support same faith ticket and same faith voting.
You started as Christian APC Leaders at what stage did you reach out to other interest groups?
There was no way we could support the position of the APC and as such, we came up with a communique that addressed the need for us to do a wider consultation and to reach out to our Muslim brothers and sisters for us to jointly search for a pan-Nigerian platform to adopt and push across the finish line in order to better serve our collective interests as Nigerians for peace, unity, progress and development of this our great country.
No sooner had we concluded that exercise than we proceeded to hold an inter-faith summit which took place at the Nigeria Air Force (NAF) Conference Centre, Kado. The major highlight of that meeting was that we resolved to form a technical committee of both Christian and Muslim leaders in the north to help articulate and craft a position for us taking into consideration only political parties that had inclusive tickets. This of course is in line with our stated vision and passion to push for an inclusive society and obviate the risks associated with our politics polarizing along religious lines.
Who chaired the Committee?
The Committee consisted of eminent personalities Chaired by the Rt Hon Mohammed Umara Kumalia with Barr Mela Nunge, SAN serving as the Secretary. The committee did an excellent job which was later fine -tuned and adopted by the larger house for presentation to the public.
So, the committee recommended that the forum should adopt Atiku/Okowa ticket as the Pan – Nigeria platform?
Certainly. The report as adopted has been presented and it speaks for itself. It is, res ipsa loquitur, as we say in law. To me, in summary, the report is the only reason why we gathered at the Shehu Musa Yar’Adua Centre on December 2, 2022 where it was presented to us. We also received inputs from religious leaders; Christian /Islamic clerics as well as women and youth groups who were well represented before we took a common position on the way forward.
In our choice of Atiku/Okowa ticket, we did a lot of analysis. We do not want to waste votes and destroy destinies. Our votes are our God given talents which we cannot waste without attracting dire consequences. Anyone who knowingly wastes his/her votes has earned the name, “wicked and slothful servant”.
Some people have said that you came out to oppose the same faith ticket of the APC after you lost out in being selected as the running mate to Bola Ahmed Tinubu. Is that true?
I have heard it said by spin Doctors including no less a personality than the candidate himself. But what do you want them to say? I guess that’s the only sensible thing to say if you want to deflect attention from the stark reality of prebendal politics that excludes nearly half the country. To begin with, I have never read anywhere that Tinubu gives power. To the contrary, only God gives power. It takes only a fool to start getting angry with a mere mortal because he didn’t put him on a ticket. I have seen the hands of God in this regard in my own life so I cannot be foolish.
My loyalty is to principles not individuals and I am profusely thankful to God who helped me very early in life to learn to be alone in a crowd. With the benefit of hindsight, I am more than grateful to God that it didn’t happen and so many friends and well wishers have also said to me they are thanking God daily that I am not on that ticket granted what they now see and know about the candidate.
What I find funny is that the candidate and his spin doctors always forget that I am not even close to the first tranche of those who first said no to the Muslim- Muslim ticket. Before me, CAN and all major Christian denominations had vehemently rejected it and as we speak they are all still stuck to their guns on the matter. Can any reasonable person say CAN and the Christian denominations that denounced it did so because they were not selected as running mates? What of some major Muslim clerics and leaders that have equally rejected same? What of the former leader of a world power that said the same faith ticket is a major problem for Nigeria? All did so because they were not selected as running mates? Give me a break. What a tasteless joke!
I want to say with every sense of responsibility that my position is based on the long term interest of this country and the need to protect the interest of people wrongly classified as minorities in this country. I believe that for Nigeria to be a first class nation, it must not hold second or third class citizens within its borders. Were it for self interest, I would have settled for some plumb favours in APC and damn the consequences; after all, which party can better serve your personal interest more than the ruling party? Do you think most of the people following Tinubu today are blind? They see the danger but their bellies are open sepulchers so they price the food they anticipate would be on the table above national interest.
Why then are you up in arms along with others against the Muslim – Muslim ticket?
It was Dr. Martin Luther King Jnr of blessed memory that reminded us that, “the ultimate measure of a man’s worth is not where he stands at the moment of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at the moment of challenges and difficulties” Of course, these are difficult moments for Nigeria and I know that some of us may not find it easy to even take a position. But if you are a student of history, you will know what division and lack of unity has done to Empires and Nations. Tell me one civilization that has ever been built by a divided people throughout human history. I challenge anyone to point at one.
Permit me to share lessons from the Roman Empire and Rwanda. The Roman Empire, as we all know, has been the most powerful in human history. There is no empire on earth that has risen to be greater than the Roman Empire. None! As powerful as the Roman Empire was, it was not defeated by an invading army. Rome merely collapsed from within on account of divisions. Rome was never conquered, it simply died due to divisions. If you think that is an ancient story, just take a look at Rwanda nearly three decades ago. Ethnic divisions between the Hutus and the Tutsis led to a genocide – a situation of near total collective suicide. It has remained a scar on our conscience as Africans as well as on the conscience of the world.
But that was Rwanda in the mid nineties, not the Rwanda of today. Rwanda today represents a major promise in Africa. Rwanda is outperforming its peers and is even strategically punching above its weight category. Why? Because the emphasis in Rwanda right now is on unity. If you mention the word Tutsi, or Hutu in Rwanda, it is regarded as “criminally divisionist”. They say we are all Rwandans. So, when it was Hutu and Tutsi, they couldn’t build a civilisation but now that they are united as Rwandans, go to Kigali and you will describe Rwanda as the miracle of Africa. I believe some of us have been there. It is just like the Roman Empire, when it was a United Empire with strong leadership, it was a conquering force and when divisions took over, it simply decayed and died on its own.
So, these two scenarios I have painted, which are true in every material sense, are pointers to us as to what will happen to our country if we fail to unite our people and develop this country. And the most dangerous thing to toy with is not even ethnicity, it is religion. If a religious war ever breaks out in this country, God forbid, that will be the end of Nigeria as we know it.
We have heard of dangerous vitriol, especially of people saying a section of Nigeria kills people and as such, all women and men that belong to that section are disqualified to hold leadership positions. Sadly, we listen to such vitriol and laugh. We also have heard people talked about religion in a manner that they pass dangerous stereotypes about Christianity or Islam, and laugh over it. But you see, in most cases, we just think those who spit such brazen hate into the political wind are merely crazy. I’ve heard people say to me, oh, no! There is no way I can ever support a Fulani man to be president, for instance, because the Fulanis are killing our people.
It’s a pity that sometimes we easily forget history. We’ve had the likes of President Shehu Shagari, in the past. Who can ever describe that great Nigerian as a terrorist or bandit? We’ve had President Umaru Musa Yar’Adua.That man was as cool as cucumber and I am saying this from the bottom of my heart. I believe, even though it was a brief romance, he could easily have passed as the best president this country has ever produced.
I’ve always said this, when Militancy turned the Niger Delta into a killing field, it was President Yaradua who rose to the occasion although he wasn’t from the Niger Delta. In the midst of recriminations and mutual mistrust over the matter, he said no, we cannot allow our people to continue killing themselves as if we are barbarians. On account of that, what was therefore a regional problem, President Yar’ Adua elevated it to a national problem and it was only at that level that we were able to find an enduring solution to the militancy in the Niger Delta that claimed many lives and billions of Naira worth of properties of Niger Deltans.
I must acknowledge that some Fulanis are majorly responsible for the perilous security situation in the country but the truth is that not all Fulanis are. Therefore, we cannot demonize the whole Fulani race because of the activities of some evil Fulani men just like we cannot demonize the whole Kanuri race because of the involvement of mainly Kanuris in the Boko Haram insurgency. We all know that there is no Nigerian tribe or race that does not hold criminal elements or killers among their ranks, except we choose to lie to ourselves. Assuming it’s entirely a Fulani or Kanuri question, is there any reasonable person out there that believes you can find a solution to the question in the absence of some level of Fulani or Kanuri leadership?
So, the point I am trying to make is that those who promote the same faith ticket and same faith voting are not just crazy, they are dangerous. They are as dangerous as those purveyors of hate on the basis of tribe or creed who demonise entire tribes and races. The truth is that if good people like you and I do not rise up to stop them, those who are crazy enough to believe they will stop us from building an inclusive society will truly succeed in destroying this nation that we cherish so much. So, we have an obligation to rise against those dangerous voices of hate and stereotypes and not just rise against them, but to quieten them so that all of us can collectively make history and build this country. This is why I will never support a Christian -Christian ticket or a Muslim – Muslim ticket in a multi ethnic, multi religious and multicultural nation like Nigeria. Our diversity must be our strength and anyone who does not want us to harness it is a rabid hater of this country and must not be anywhere near the seat of the Presidency.
Don’t you fear that some people may see you as someone who is against Muslims or Islam?
I have heard such comments. Someone recently said to me, if you don’t subscribe to the APC code and support Tinubu, people will think you don’t like Muslims. I said, no. That is not what I’m looking at. I’m looking at Nigeria, I’m looking at unity, I’m looking at a government that can pass as legitimate to virtually every Nigerian. I said if the question was the same faith ticket involving Christian-Christian, I might even do more in opposing that ticket because I believe that it doesn’t tally with my vision of a greater Nigeria. Those of us who will say an emphatic no to Muslim – Muslim ticket and Christian-Christian ticket will do so not because we are not Muslims or Christians but because we believe justice and fairness are a basic, pedestrian and irreducible minimums of the demands of our creed and that it will take the collective efforts of Christians and Muslims from the south and north to build this great nation.
What do you make of Tinubu and his spin doctors who have been attacking you on all media platforms?
I hate to talk about people especially when it relates to information you obtain in confidence. So I won’t say anything about what I know when working closely with them except I obtain their consent to discuss them. I can only talk about what I see now and the compelling revelations that are pouring in almost daily.
Anytime I listened to the candidate speak at rallies or events and watch how character impeaching revelations are left to stagnate, I feel so much pains so much so that I believe anyone who sees the condition of the candidate and does not feel the pains is either a wicked person or is actually the person who is sick. I think his spin doctors harbour some extravagant delusions. They think the Presidency would make the president better, no! It would only reveal who the president truly is. My candid assessment is that if Asiwaju were to make it to the presidency, I believe he will regret securing the prize for which he has struggled so long, because the experience of the presidency will lay bare his absolute unfitness for it. What we see now assuredly is what we shall get from him as President. Mark my word, if he makes it, his presidency will certainly reveal a contempt for Rules, precedent, order,stability and national cohesion.
As for the spin doctors, they have forgotten that dignity still matters in public office and it is unlikely that they will ever have it. So instead of addressing issues they believe they can insult their way to the presidency. Yet their graver vice is cowardice, reflected in a willingness to always lie to the public to please and appease, heedless of the inevitability of its contradiction, moments later.
What other concerns do you have about the APC and its candidate?
Apart from the same faith ticket my additional worry is that the candidate himself is running out of ropes on devastating revelations touching on his character. Unfortunately for him, in order for anyone to lead he/she must be a person of influence and without character you cannot influence people. People are more intrigued by your example than your words which your character can easily cancel. They may continue to hide and deceive people, but history will never be kind to them.
I now see the candidate as a cultural heroine because he makes huge segments of our people feel better (for obvious reasons) as long as the effects last but he cannot heal what ails them. As I said earlier, with him, assuredly what we see, is what it is! It is up to us Nigerians. The moment is upon us to decide whether we want to elevate the greed of a few above the needs of the many.
What bothers me with the stand you have taken is the fact that you framed the issues around justice and fairness, yet you are supporting a Northerner to take over from another northerner, is that not a contradiction in terms?
I can tell you for free that I don’t have any problem with a southerner becoming president, I will certainly work for an Igbo man or woman to be president one day because I don’t believe in the stereotypes we tend to propagate against the Igbos. I have met Igbo leaders whose lives are a legendary epic and I can say are even overqualified to occupy the office of the Presidency. The only issue I have with the way you have also framed the issues yourself is that it ignores the fact that the North East where I come from, of all the zones, is the most cheated since Independence.
The South East has produced the great Zik and Gen Aguiyi – Ironsi and they had Alex Ekweme as Vice President in the second republic but since Tafawa Balewa the North East has never ruled Nigeria? Therefore, judge for yourself, between the South East and North East which zone deserves to produce the President first? I have always said to my South East friends that in as much as I believe Nigeria has not been fair to the South East in terms of the Presidency, I also believe that we in the North East are ahead of them and we do laugh over it. Even in National budgetary allocations since the advent of this democracy, the South East has always gotten more than the North East. Go and do the analysis of federal budgets over the years and revert if my assertions are not true.
When it comes to South versus the North, sum up the years of Presidents OBJ and Jonathan from the south and sum up those of Presidents Yar’Adua and PMB from the North, you will discover that the South is ahead of the North by almost 4 years. Therefore, if we are just and fair in our analysis, we must admit that the North needs to cover four more years to catch up with the South. That being the case, I see no injustice in the position we have taken. The requirements of justice favours the North East where Atiku Abubakar comes from more than the South East and between the South and North, it will be justice for the North to be allowed to catch up and balance the years then we move on from there.
Every promoter of justice and fairness must come to one unequivocal conclusion that for Nigeria to rise the South East must be given the unflinching support to produce the President just like the North East too must be equally supported to produce the President. Justice is not divisible so what is justice for the South East must be justice for the North East and what is justice for the South must also be justice for the North. I totally reject the narratives that exclude the North East from consideration for the Presidency as if we are not part of Nigeria.
Where is Engr Babachir David Lawal on these issues, if I may ask. You started this struggle together and suddenly we saw him in the Labour Party, what happened?
Like him or hate him, he is such an enigma. He has been an inspiration to all of us. He is never short of words and never shy to canvas his position. I am sure he would welcome the opportunity to oblige you with an interview. 21,000 but only just about 3600 bed spaces and so the majority of the students are living within the community and because of that once you had young men and women that are coming from different culture backgrounds coming in to a new environment where they are bound to have some challenges or problems and so once in a while student do have issues maybe with the security agencies so I thought we should try and ensure that we provide additional hostel so that more students can be accommodated and we were able to get the support of the Chairman of Urban Shelter Limited Saudauna Minna Mallam Ibrahim Aliyu initially they promise to provide about 5,500 bed space unfortunately for us since the MoU was signed we had a serious challenges first of all we had the COVID 19 and then we had all the issues of devaluation of naira inflation and then ASUU strike long and protracted strike and so it became obvious to us that all of the initial assumptions and projection with respect to what we are going to charge after the building of the student hostel was completely obliterated and we were lucky that in the last two weeks we visited him and he was so gracious to see that the current 1500 spaces that we have build already is handed over to the university as a donation so we want to thank Mallam Ibrahim Aliyu for that which generosity and since then also we were able to attract funds from TETFUND for additional hostel accommodation so am happy to say that it is a major achievement in term of providing for the student and other things that affected student are the issues academics and we were able to convince Senate and it brought about improving on students retention in the university and graduations so including the retention rate and one of those issues is at what CGPA as at what point a student is to be withdrawn from the university and as I came in and the time I came in one hundred level students as the end of their first year if they didn’t make 1.5 CGPA are automatically withdrawn and that was a bit too harsh on students these are new students coming in most of them coming into new environment most of them coming into university for the first time and they should be given an opportunity ; the second chance and we are able to convince Senate to say that just at the other level two hundred to five hundred level are given progression and the hundred level should also be able to have progression and we should be able to lower the retention from 1.5 to 1.0 for the student and since then retention and graduation has massively improved and to me again the major achievement the other one is issue of transport of course by the time I came in we are already giving grandaunds their certificate and convocation we also succeeded in ensuring that transcripts are usually take six month up to one year befor people could get it, initially we started by making sure that within two weeks of applications they will get their transcript as at today every think are been computerized and application can be treated and applicant can get their transcript quickly. so these are the things we are able to do for the students and I think the major achievements were the ability to provide structures building class rooms laboratory that will allow for the relocation of three schools from the Bosso campus to Gidan Kwano campus and three hundred projrcts from TETFUND and risk assessment to me I think is a major achievements to do and of course the other one that I consider very important was the fact that when I came in 2017 five of our courses were deleted as a result of decision of the federal executive council and the two other courses were denied accreditation from NUC Making then seven as at today Iam happy to say that all those courses have been restored and are due for accreditation between this year and next year so to me I feel highly gratified that we are able to make this core achievements.
What are the Courses
We had Physic education and I think Chemistry Geography were denied accreditation and others were the management courses initially it was thought that management courses should not be part of the mandate of university, so we have project management ,transport management and many of this other information and media technology library information technology but today we are able to sit down with NUC we have reviewed the curriculum and so we have the programmes now operationally again.
What is the position of the African Centre of Excellence in the School?
The Africa Centre of Excellence is a major achievement , Africa centre of excellence that is the area of research are project with the university we are able to secure a project worth 6 million dollars funded by the World Bank and led to the establishment of Africa Centre of Excellence . And generally the levels of research have increased in the university all of these to us are areas that we can say we have made difference.
It’s no longer a news that Academic Staff Union of Universities ASUU and Federal Government have dragged on leading to several Strikes and the long one recentlly as a Vice Chancellor what is your take?
Well, to me I think both ASUU and Federal government are engaged themselves in discussion of deaf and dump they don’t seem to understand themselves and I think there is a problem on the part of the Federal Government and problem on the part of ASUU.
Federal government has a desire to manage it fund and that is why it has push for university staff enrol in IPPIS but in doing that it has come with a lot of problems that borders on the autonomy of the university, university have unique practices that have not been captured or accommodated by the IPPIS and the major one to me which I feel is gradually killing the university is the idea that vice chancellors now are not to recruit staff you seek permission from Head of Service from budget office and federal character commission in the last one year alone we have lost large number of staff they have retired from university they have resigned their appointment from university and of course we have the number of people who have died and for difference reason we have people living the university and they have created vacancies within the university ordinarily vice chancellors should be able to get competent hands that can come in and replace and not asking for additional hands that will bring about increase in salary that is affecting federal government no, what we are asking we should be able to replace this ones that are already been funded but you cannot do that because even if you are able to do that you will still get approval for them to be capture within the IPPIS so to me that is the problem with the Federal government, the major one for ASUU, we have been saying; is that there must be a change in some of the things we are doing, declaring strike for long period of time is not going to help the matter it just gradually killing the system so as academics we have to start thinking of other ways by which would begin to press home our demands, we would try and see how we are going to address some of the issues there is no doubt that some of this issues are there and are germane there are some of us that also have issues with certain things that are been pursue for example some of us feel that ASUU should not be going on strike because they want federal government to instruct or to stop proliferation of state universities because constitution is very clear about that education is in concurrent list, state have the right to setup their own university of course federal government through the instrumentality of NUC should be able to ensure that these universities meet the basic requirements but to say putting these issue of proliferation of state universities is one of your issue that are making ASUU go on strike , some of us just don’t understand, so to us these are the things , even the UTAS will spent so much efforts talking of the UTAS we understand the spirit the UTAS is suppose to replace the IPPIS but the problem there is not the software not the payment platform the problem is this idea that university cannot recruit unless getting permission from Head of service from Federal Character or from budget planning office because even if you replace the IPPIS with the UTAS you will still have to get that same permission for you to be able to get the staff so to us I feel the Union also need to set down and re-strategise issues in more practical manner so both side need to actually need to make some concessions for peace and stability in the campuses
in a situation whereby governments have not been able to provide for the existing university and they are announcing establishment of new universities, how do you see that?
Is a problem to us we see it as a problem because like a parents that continue to give birth to so many children when you cannot cater for them you know that the once you have and you have not been able to chatter for them and then you are now trying to produce more children definitely is a problem the sooner they realize that , the better for everybody but beyond that we should also look at this problem from the perspective of government because year in year out you have close to one Millions Nigeria Youth applying through JAMB for university education and at the end of the day less than fifty percent are able to get admission in to this public universities and so government in its own wisdom , wants to improve access by providing more but if you are providing more you should also start thinking that additional funds is provided , so to me these are the issues that should be looked into and as an individual giving my position as a vice chancellor government is spending a lot of money on education, to me I feel that there should be a proper discussion as how to channel the money been spent by federal government but there is a lot of money coming to the universities perhaps not for the right reasons, so much money is coming into university either directly through appropriation or through TETFUND we tend to forget that TUTFUND is an agency of government and so in addition to whatever government is providing through appropriation also some monies are coming in through TETFUND and beyond that you look at all other government agencies you see them spending money on the universities I will just give you an example For example National Information Technology Development Agency every year they spend money in establishing centres in universities they spend money in sponsoring academic staff in university and other people for Postgraduate programmes and they do a number of things, in fact just recently last week the Minister announce another initiative brought provision of facilities to twenty university and each of this university will get nothing less than N400 million you go to NCC, NCC spends money in terms of provision of digital facilities in universities, like university of Technology Minna FUT Minna last year they give us a professorial chair of N20 million and they do many other things they give scholarship and every other things you go to Ministry of works, ministry of works spends millions of naira building roads providing other facilities in the university just last year they build about 1.1 kilometer road in our own university FUT Minna and you move other agencies , PTDF Petroleum Technology Development they spend millions of naira sponsoring academic staff within Nigeria and outside Nigeria you have federal scholarship board sponsoring people so when you look at it , is so much money been spent on education but usually when we are speaking on education we just look at what government appropriated under education and we say there is nothing but by the time you look at the totally of money coming from government in to Universities, into education sector is a lot of money.
You didn’t say anything to provide for indigent student by giving them scholarship and you established a fund for indigent student how do u want this type of thing to continue now you are not there again?
Am hoping that it would be sustainable because it an an idea that actually started from the senate of the university around 2018/2019 senate began to see a large number of students applying for the deferment of their admission because they cannot it, others dropping out because they cannot pay their fees and then we began to asked questions why is it so and we thought that it Would not be proper that we allow such students to drop out of school because they cannot pay their registration fees and that is when we start thinking of what to do , we set up a fund where we can now mobilize funds so that at least at the minimum they should be able to have their registration fee and then they can think of how they can take care of themselves, But am also happy to say that since then even the Alumni of the university has taken up the challenge and they have promise that next year 2023 they are going to setup a fifty million endowment fund for the purpose of supporting indigent students in the university so I hope that these particular initiative would be sustainable
The University has been involved in oil and gas exploration in Bida Basin and recently their has been first oil drill in Gombe and Bauchi axis , how far has the university gone on the Bida Basin exploration?
We had scientist from the university carrying out individual research with the Basin but in time of collaboration with NNPC and other oil well companies I think that collaboration is a relatively new as at last year NNPC commission this university along with IBBU Lapai, Usman Danfodio Sokoto and Federal University Kebbi and to undertake environmental impact assessment within the Niger, Bida and Sokoto Basin ad this is the preparation for exploration that is to further scale up in times of explorative activities and the essence is to say, what would be the impact so we are at first stage we have submitted the report and I believe that in a few months time , there would be activities at the Bida and the Sokoto Basin, so I believe that NNPC is very much committed to exploration activities in the basins
What is your plan after Your tenure now as VC
For now truly am suppose to go for my one year sabbatical plus my accumulated leave after that I intended to come back as a university lecturer and beyond that only God knows.
What is your take on the autonomy of universities, should universities be allowed to generate money considering the argument that if universities are allow to do that university education would be out of the reach of common man children
Well, let me say that we have several model we can learn across the world and hardly any country where government withdraw from funding of university system usually what you see is government coming in and how much are you going to spend for examples training a medical students from the first year to the last year and base on that government can decide okey for this training this amount every student the sixty percent of the cost you go and take care of forty percent of the cost and in taking care of the forty percent the cost you cannot charge student above this , that is the usual thing , so that these students that are going to pay bills remaining forty percent , you have a model that those that can pay from their pocket those that are rich enough they can go and they can just pay, those that are indigent and cannot afford can go to this bank and get this money paid for them to be able to go to school under an arrangement , we know from practice like in the UK in the US after the graduation you are not expected to even started paying until you are able to get a job that fetches you a minimum salary, that is when you start paying and then you should be able to finish paying within thirty years whether or not finish paying after thirty years of graduation that is it and government is suppose to guarantee that bank now we cannot take this practices home here from UK, US and bring them here because we have problem of data management we have problem of identity management we have problem of people after graduating doing Japa , they will now go to US, Canada and then they will go there so these are issues that must be tackle but the reality is that federal government alone or state government alone cannot adequately take care of funding education and we should also be mindful of the fact that is not every student that is poor we have three kinds of categories of students in every institutions you have the indigent student that whatever happens they will need help they are indigent and he should be able to get empirical data suppose that these people cannot help and then what can you do to help them , then we have the regular students who ordinary your own children by the time you struggle, here and there he should be able to pay if you are charge two hundred thousand he should be able to pay these are regular students and these are suppose to be the majority that most of then can actually pay and then we have the affluent students the children of the rich that no matter how much you are asking they would pay but today because of the philosophical direction of ASUU and other people we have subjected ourselves to just thinking in the direction of only indigent students we cannot pay we cannot pay is not everybody that cannot pay so the institutions themselves should put in place frame work where by those who cannot pay are provided opportunity for them to pay and that is actually what FUT Minna is doing to save those that cannot pay, if we can confirm that these student cannot pay we have an indigent forms that would help them also by making us to charge at the level of indigent students, then if you are not indigent you should b charging at the level of regularity , so that the university can become regular and would be able to meet most of its needs without having always run to federal government so there should be a balance we are not talking of the affluent we are not talking of indigent we are talking of the regular to me that is my thinking .
2023: Middle Belt Will Zone In One Direction – Dr Adoyi Omale
Dr Adoyi Mathew Omale is a former Local Government Chairman of Ogbadibo in Benue and a leader in the Middle Belt. In this Interview with SUNDAY ISUWA, the former Student Union President of Ahmadu Bello University (ABU) Zaria and former Director of Democratic Institute says the Middle Belt will vote in one direction in the 2023 presidential election amongst other issues.
There is a lot of contention concerning the 2023 presidential election. Which party should Nigerians support ?
Thank you very much for your question. First and foremost 2023 is an opportunity for Nigerians to enrich our democracy. It’s an opportunity for Nigerians to make a wise and pragmatic choice. Why do I say this? Haven had democracy for the past 22 years, you will agree with me that the democracy has not translated to food on the table for the ordinary man. Democracy has had its ups and downs. Tried as successive regimes have in the last few years, is a lot of gaps that need to be filled. Let me say that I have had the course to be involved with all the major political parties since 1999. And I want to say without fear or favour that most of the political parties that have been trusted with leadership have betrayed the trust, the social contract which the people entered with them. Why do I reach this conclusion? I was in the PDP, we fought the military when I was in ABU. We fought the military. The Abachas, the IBBs because we felt that democracy was the best for this country. We led students to fight and luckily in 1999 the military exited the PDP came into power with all the hopes. Don’t forget that just like we fought during the G34 when the G34 started, Nigerians, I remember we were told that look, you are just wasting your time, G34 will fizzle out, but G34 was able to lead the struggle, which culminated into PDP. Again, after PDP came to power, the CPC and other political parties came board. I left the PDP because I felt the PDP had not perform enough. And that was why we aligned with the APC in 2015. Again, doubting Thomases that no ruling president has ever lost election in Africa. We told them that it will happen and the rest is now history, APC won. Again, we are saying in 2023, Nigerians voices are clear? Yes, everybody, Soludo, anybody can say anything about whether Peter Obi will win or not. But we the Nigerian people, we have made our choice, we want a clear change, we want a clear direction and irrespective of what some of the elites feel they are going to be shocked in 2023. Like I said in 1999, people thought that it was not going to happen. In 2015, people thought it was not going to happen, it happened. In 2023, people are still skeptical but it is going to happen. That is just what I will say. Of course, you know that I am in full support of the Labour Party winning the 20203 election.
We have seen a very serious campaign coming up from the labor party since Mr Peter Obi became a candidate. Do you think this will translate to actual voting?
Yes, you know, because of the Nigerian political system, I told you have been very much involved in Nigerian grassroots political development in the last 22 years or before then. One thing you should know is that politics is dynamic. The trends keep on changing. The issues keep on changing. No particular election has the same scenario. The essence of this whole arrangement is that change is possible and since it’s democracy where the will of the people will have to prevail, we have no doubt that come 2023, the voice of the people will prevail, especially with the card readers and the BVAS. It is not going to be business as usual, where people go to the polling booth with thumbprint ballot boxes and stuff them, or even snatch ballot boxes and take them to another location. We are confident that for the first time in the history of Nigeria, human beings will go to the pooling boot queue up and vote according to their conscience. And I don’t see any Nigerian in his right mind who will vote for APC or either PDP. Because, the type of damage that these two political parties have done to our country is only God that will redeem it. And we believed that maybe the Labour party, when they take over power, will redeem it. I say this without fear of contradiction.
APC fielded Muslim Muslim ticket. Atiku from the North picks a running mate from the South. The Middle Belt, a region you come from, are you sure that they are going to vote for Peter Obi and why?
Yes. They are going to vote for Peter Obi. The North Central and by extension, the entire middle belt, are going to vote for Peter Obi. Why do I say this? We have been supporting progressive politics for a very long time and it is not going to change with this election. Whether it is Benue, Plateau, Nasarawa, Niger, Kwara. Yes, the issue of religion will matter but above all what the middle belt is interested in is quality leadership. And quality leadership is what we lack in Nigeria today. Even elementary students of political science, the Nigeria youth know that the problem with our country today is the problem of leadership. And if the problem with our country is a problem of leadership, why should we shy away from putting the leadership that is capable of providing the needed change. I don’t see Atiku or Tinubu as having the competence or the qualities to lead Nigeria in 2023. And I say without mincing words. So, why are we shying away from that? The middle belt has taken the opposition. The middle belt have resolved that come 2033, they are going to vote enmass for the labor party. Yes, the issue of Muslim-Muslim ticket is one of the reasons. Because in a multi-puller country like Nigeria, where the country does not belong to a particular religion. Our constitution is very clear that we are a circular country in that kind of situation, you have to be sensitive to the component units of the country. But if Tinubu being Muslim, decided to pick a Muslim-Muslim ticket, then the middle belt, especially the Northern Christians have a right to to express themselves in that regard. And let me say that for Atiku, whether it’s not East or not West, my own thinking is that Peter Obi should be able to win South East, no matter the opposition from there, he should be able to win South South, no matter the opposition, he should be able to win the middle belt, and that will give him the election. Yes, he is going to get votes from the North East and the North West and that is substantial. I see him as someone who is going to emerge. Only those that are benefiting from the current status quo are shouting PDP or APC.
But the constitution requires that for one to emerge president, he or she must get at least 25% votes in all the states.
Peter Obi is going to get it. In Kaduna for example, where you come from, I think he should be able to get that from Southern Kaduna. Peter Obi. I think that in Gombe State, in Kebbi state, all the northern minorities will be able to vote for him even in Borno State, Peter Obi should be able to get that. So, I can mention 10 states now in the north that he is going to get more than before we now add the Southern states.
But the places you are mentioning are traditionally PDP. So, do you think they will abandon the PDP?
No, this election in 2023 is not about tradition. It’s a movement that is willing to change the political landscape of Nigeria. People are not voting for political parties. People are now going to vote for three candidates. They either vote for Atiku, Tinubu or Peter Obi. So, nobody is still looking at political parties. Political parties are just mere vehicles of expression.
People say the Labour party doesn’t have structures?
When they talk about structures, they are only talking about corruption. All these issues about structure are corruption and monetisation of the political process.
Yes. And your political party said that there is no ‘shi shi.’
Yes. Yes.
So, how will that work with the kind of mindset that we have?
We are mobilizing Nigerians. The structure of the labor party is now everywhere. There is no village, no ward in the country now that the labour party has not been instituted in the last six months. Yes, hitherto, before now, the PDP and APC were riding roughshod over everybody, but they themselves know that the labor party has also moved in and then spread itself across the country. So you cannot talk about physical structure, we have built the physical structure, what is left now is for us to continue our sensitization, to continue the public enlightenment. If we are not there, why are they worried? Why are they saying that we cannot win the election? Why all this propaganda? Why all these issues? Because we are there and that is why they are worried. So the labor party has been able to organize itself, is a very potent political machinery, just like the APC, the APC was formed a few months before the general election, almost less than a year before the general election and it swept most parts of the country. So we are going to see that replicated with the labor party. Transcends tribe, it transcends religion, it transcends gender. So it’s a mass movement and Nigerians for once, want a change in the leadership of this country. We cannot continue like this. Everybody knows that our country has been seriously damaged and we have to do something about it. We cannot just sit down and fold our hands and be wishing for something to happen. The whole world is watching this election and that is why this emergence of Peter Obi has given hope that something good can come out of Nigeria. And let me emphasize that the good thing about Obi coming is that the Igbo people who have fought a very brutal civil war in the 70s for the first time, would have been reintegrated into the mainstream of Nigerian politics if Peter becomes the president. And let me also emphasize that with this disintegration in the South East, the Obi presidency will finish this agitation by IPOB or Biafra agitators. Tell me, after Obasanjo’s eight years, what is Tinubu doing in the contest? It is not the turn of the South West. I am supporting the Labour party’s Peter Obi because it is not the turn of the Southwest. Whether he says it is emilokan or whatever, it is not their turn. And it is certainly not the turn of Atiku who is also from the North. Buhari has done the right things. So, if we say that Nigeria’s presidency should rotate, then let us be factual. There is nobody, there is no part of the country that is not competent to rule this country. And I want to say that the North has had it, Buhari has had it for eight years. So, Atiku is a good candidate, but it is not his turn. Tinubu, it is not the turn of the Southwest, even if it is the turn of the South, it is not the turn of the Southwest. So certainly, he should step aside. We who are from the middle belt, who are supposed to be in between, we have made our choice because it is the turn of the South East.
We still have undecided voters. What is your message to them?
My message to the undecided voters is very clear. 2034, we either repair Nigeria or we continue at this point. I heard Tinubu saying that he is going to continue with the beautiful programmes of Muhammadu Buhari. Is that what we want to continue in 2023 or we want to really, genuinely solve our leadership problem in this country. The revolution does not end with just electing Peter Obi. We have to look at the quality of people we are electing into the national assembly. You have to look at the quality of those who we are electing to the State Houses of Assembly, we have to look at the quality of people we elect as Governors. I want to tell you that though I am in the labor party, I am supporting some states, and some of my friends are running under some parties. In Adamawa I have friends that are running under PDP. And I think they are good. I can campaign for them. I have friends that are running under ADC and they are good. I can campaign for them. People should not rigidly be talking about political parties in Nigeria political system any longer. We have to look at candidates and then put on the business of competency.
